I occasionally tow my Honda CR-V behind my Chinook. A Very Concerned Relative is pushing me to get a brake assist system for when I'm towing the car. According to the specs for my model, the curb weight is just over 3300 pounds. Texas doesn't seem to require them for vehicles that light. And I've towed it quite a lot without ever being able to even feel it back there. But on the other hand, some places do require them and it kind of seems like a good precaution... So I'm kind of on the fence about it.
I've seen a Brake Buddy, which is, frankly, kind of a PIA to use, so I'm not crazy about that idea.
Do you guys use aux braking systems, and if so, do you have any recommendations for type/brand/model?
Brake assist systems
Brake assist systems
1999 Premier, now minus all passenger side cabinets and appliances 
Re: Brake assist systems
I do. I think it's the law in many places, but I just do it because I don't want to use my Chinook brakes to stop an additional 4,000# (3,500# car plus I add for stuff inside even though it's likely not that much). I wouldn't tow my boat without trailer brakes, and that is about 4,500#.
Funny but I bought a CR-V to make into a toad, but then before I got it set up, a friend made me a deal I couldn't refuse on a car already set up for towing. The one issue I think I might have had with the CR-V is that they showed the baseplate arms coming out at something like 21" off the ground. The car I tow now has them at 16" from the ground and that's a perfect match for the tow bar. So with the CR-V I would have had to use a "riser" bar on the Chinook hitch to meet the tow bar's specs for levelness. This was a 2005 CR-V, btw - newer ones may be lower.
Anyway, back to the braking system. I think the Brake Buddy type system would drive me nuts. I hate stuff I have to move in and out of the way.
As it turned out, the car I lucked into has the system that was my first choice, which is the Stay in Play. Everything is on the car (so anyone who tows it has brakes), it's proportional and adjustable, and the only thing to do when you go to tow is flip a toggle switch. Other than that you wouldn't even know it was there (and the toggle switch is down by your ankle, so not some hokey thing on the dash).
The same friend had a different braking system on a previous toad, but part of it was on the RV. So that system required that RV and that car to be mated together (or another RV with the same system).
So I'd highly recommend the Stay in Play. I'm sure there are other good systems out there too.
For an easy/economical system, I'd be interested to try the Ready Brute Elite. That's a tow bar with a surge brake built into it. There are situations where you have to be more aware with surge brakes, but then who tows unaware anyway.
BG
PS: I did tow a 2,500# car (the aforementioned friend's previous car) without a braking system (with my camper van). Reason I had no braking system is that that was the type where half of the system was on the RV, and I wasn't towing with that RV (with the Stay in Play I would have had a full braking system even though it wasn't my toad).. Actually it was when I went to pick up my Chinook. Drove camper van to look at Chinook; drove Chinook home. Then drove friend's tow car back and hitched it up to my camper van and drove that train home. Whee!
Although too, the camper van had better brakes than the stock Chinook. Well, the same brakes but 3,000# less vehicle attached to them. Anyway, that wasn't horrible, but I would not have done it on a regular basis. It just seems like the kind of thing that's fine as long as everything is going your way. But at least in that case it was a completely empty tiny light car. I don't know how anyone could have an actual working toad that was empty - I mean... how?!
Funny but I bought a CR-V to make into a toad, but then before I got it set up, a friend made me a deal I couldn't refuse on a car already set up for towing. The one issue I think I might have had with the CR-V is that they showed the baseplate arms coming out at something like 21" off the ground. The car I tow now has them at 16" from the ground and that's a perfect match for the tow bar. So with the CR-V I would have had to use a "riser" bar on the Chinook hitch to meet the tow bar's specs for levelness. This was a 2005 CR-V, btw - newer ones may be lower.
Anyway, back to the braking system. I think the Brake Buddy type system would drive me nuts. I hate stuff I have to move in and out of the way.
As it turned out, the car I lucked into has the system that was my first choice, which is the Stay in Play. Everything is on the car (so anyone who tows it has brakes), it's proportional and adjustable, and the only thing to do when you go to tow is flip a toggle switch. Other than that you wouldn't even know it was there (and the toggle switch is down by your ankle, so not some hokey thing on the dash).
The same friend had a different braking system on a previous toad, but part of it was on the RV. So that system required that RV and that car to be mated together (or another RV with the same system).
So I'd highly recommend the Stay in Play. I'm sure there are other good systems out there too.
For an easy/economical system, I'd be interested to try the Ready Brute Elite. That's a tow bar with a surge brake built into it. There are situations where you have to be more aware with surge brakes, but then who tows unaware anyway.
BG
PS: I did tow a 2,500# car (the aforementioned friend's previous car) without a braking system (with my camper van). Reason I had no braking system is that that was the type where half of the system was on the RV, and I wasn't towing with that RV (with the Stay in Play I would have had a full braking system even though it wasn't my toad).. Actually it was when I went to pick up my Chinook. Drove camper van to look at Chinook; drove Chinook home. Then drove friend's tow car back and hitched it up to my camper van and drove that train home. Whee!
Although too, the camper van had better brakes than the stock Chinook. Well, the same brakes but 3,000# less vehicle attached to them. Anyway, that wasn't horrible, but I would not have done it on a regular basis. It just seems like the kind of thing that's fine as long as everything is going your way. But at least in that case it was a completely empty tiny light car. I don't know how anyone could have an actual working toad that was empty - I mean... how?!
1999 Concourse
Re: Brake assist systems
Heheh. My toad is almost always empty apart from a few odds and ends that live in it full-time, even when it's not toad-ing. I rarely bring it along, so I tend not to think about it as potential storage when I'm camping.
I had a Ford Focus that I was getting ready to set up for towing when I got an offer I couldn't refuse on the Honda CR-V, already set up for towing It's a 2006, and I couldn't tell you what kind of tow bar it has. I don't think I've seen a brand on it. It had never occurred to me to worry about whether it was level when towing... I think it's close, though. I can tell you that the brackets the tow bar attaches to are really hard on the shins in the middle of the night.
Thanks for the recommendations!
I had a Ford Focus that I was getting ready to set up for towing when I got an offer I couldn't refuse on the Honda CR-V, already set up for towing
It's a 2006, and I couldn't tell you what kind of tow bar it has. I don't think I've seen a brand on it. It had never occurred to me to worry about whether it was level when towing... I think it's close, though. I can tell you that the brackets the tow bar attaches to are really hard on the shins in the middle of the night.Thanks for the recommendations!
1999 Premier, now minus all passenger side cabinets and appliances
Re: Brake assist systems
Okay, well that's interesting. A 2006 is basically the same car as my 2005 (Gen 2.5). I actually still have that car - just haven't got around to selling it yet, plus I had to hunt and hunt 'cause I wanted a 2005 or 2006, original owner, records, AWD, manual trans, etc. So naturally right after I bought it the other car that was already set up came into the picture 
If your baseplate has shin knockers, I'm going to guess it's a Roadmaster. I have a Blue Ox baseplate, and the "arms" are basically completely under the car once you remove tow bar. (That other car I towed when I went to get my Chinook had a Roadmaster setup.) I think Roadmaster now has some "concealed" ones too that they came out with. Anyway, they work similarly.
If it were me I'd look up the specs for the tow bar. Some models want them completely level. Others will allow a down angle to the car from the RV but not an up angle. Mine will accommodate 3" up or down, but they don't all allow for that. Still, since the 16" is completely level, I would think a 21" connection would be 5" up? (The reason the baseplates come out at different heights just has to do with the frame and grille design of the car.)
I think especially if you have an up angle to the car, that it can cause a problem when stopping fast (car rides up). Something to check into anyway. It might be more of an issue if no car brakes.
I'd still run with brakes even on a 3300# "empty" car (which is surely at least 3,500# with some fluids and a few things inside). If not, then I guess maybe print out a list of how the laws do or don't apply in various states as that may come in handy. (For example, if NV requires brakes on anything over 3,000# but your car is registered in Texas, do you need to comply?)
If your baseplate has shin knockers, I'm going to guess it's a Roadmaster. I have a Blue Ox baseplate, and the "arms" are basically completely under the car once you remove tow bar. (That other car I towed when I went to get my Chinook had a Roadmaster setup.) I think Roadmaster now has some "concealed" ones too that they came out with. Anyway, they work similarly.
If it were me I'd look up the specs for the tow bar. Some models want them completely level. Others will allow a down angle to the car from the RV but not an up angle. Mine will accommodate 3" up or down, but they don't all allow for that. Still, since the 16" is completely level, I would think a 21" connection would be 5" up? (The reason the baseplates come out at different heights just has to do with the frame and grille design of the car.)
I think especially if you have an up angle to the car, that it can cause a problem when stopping fast (car rides up). Something to check into anyway. It might be more of an issue if no car brakes.
I'd still run with brakes even on a 3300# "empty" car (which is surely at least 3,500# with some fluids and a few things inside). If not, then I guess maybe print out a list of how the laws do or don't apply in various states as that may come in handy. (For example, if NV requires brakes on anything over 3,000# but your car is registered in Texas, do you need to comply?)
1999 Concourse
Re: Brake assist systems
The Stay-in-Play looks like a great option - exactly what I'd prefer to use.
1999 Premier, now minus all passenger side cabinets and appliances
Re: Brake assist systems
I've found it to be excellent. No complaints at all. You don't control it from the cab like a regular trailer brake controller, but you can easily adjust the proportional strength with a slider that's by the switch in the car. That's what makes it work with any vehicle you hook it up to: All the braking is in the car.
The only thing to potentially watch out for is that the shop who installed it on the car I'm now towing (when it belonged to my buddy) put the main box right in front of the radiator (which they tell you not to do). And my car doesn't need any hindrances to cooling! I watched a bunch of videos on etrailer to get a feel for all the places they put the box and how they mount it, and I think I'm going to move it back by the firewall. (It''s not that the box is having a problem, but just that it's blocking air from the radiator when I drive the car separately.)
If I bought one new now, I'd install it myself.
BG
PS: I did wish that there was a way to just use something like a Tekonsha P3, that could double as a regular trailer brake controller, but I didn't really find any way to do that (I'm sure someone has, but no normal way anyway).
The only thing to potentially watch out for is that the shop who installed it on the car I'm now towing (when it belonged to my buddy) put the main box right in front of the radiator (which they tell you not to do). And my car doesn't need any hindrances to cooling! I watched a bunch of videos on etrailer to get a feel for all the places they put the box and how they mount it, and I think I'm going to move it back by the firewall. (It''s not that the box is having a problem, but just that it's blocking air from the radiator when I drive the car separately.)
If I bought one new now, I'd install it myself.
BG
PS: I did wish that there was a way to just use something like a Tekonsha P3, that could double as a regular trailer brake controller, but I didn't really find any way to do that (I'm sure someone has, but no normal way anyway).
1999 Concourse
Re: Brake assist systems
Thought I'd post a follow-up, since I finally got this done.
I took my camper in to an RV service place here in Houston (PPL) to have them install a brake assist system. I about had a heart attack when they quoted the labor cost for something like the Stay-In-Play. The materials cost was about the same between that and a Brake Buddy, but the labor cost meant it would end up about double the cost. I ... just couldn't do it. If I traveled with my car on a regular basis, moving every day or two, then I'd probably have gone for it, but I do maybe one trip every two or three years where I take a car along, and it's usually one stop, using the car for day tripping from a hub.
So, yeah, ended up with what I'd set out NOT wanting, a Brake Buddy. They have improved a bit from the one my mother has, at least, and it's way easier to hook up in the CR-V than it was in her Ford Focus, because the CR-V sits higher and the pedals are easier to reach from the door. It has a fold-down handle that doubles as the surface it uses to push against the seat, so it only requires me to move my seat forward, not change height, etc, the way we had to in the Focus. It has adjustable proportional braking, with a controller in the cab to let you adjust it if conditions change. So, not as much of a PIA as it could've been.
Hooked up with the tow bar and lo and behold, a downward angle, as Blue~Go suspected. Not steep, but enough to warrant a riser for the hitch.
So, now I'm ready to tow safely for my trip in November
I took my camper in to an RV service place here in Houston (PPL) to have them install a brake assist system. I about had a heart attack when they quoted the labor cost for something like the Stay-In-Play. The materials cost was about the same between that and a Brake Buddy, but the labor cost meant it would end up about double the cost. I ... just couldn't do it. If I traveled with my car on a regular basis, moving every day or two, then I'd probably have gone for it, but I do maybe one trip every two or three years where I take a car along, and it's usually one stop, using the car for day tripping from a hub.
So, yeah, ended up with what I'd set out NOT wanting, a Brake Buddy. They have improved a bit from the one my mother has, at least, and it's way easier to hook up in the CR-V than it was in her Ford Focus, because the CR-V sits higher and the pedals are easier to reach from the door. It has a fold-down handle that doubles as the surface it uses to push against the seat, so it only requires me to move my seat forward, not change height, etc, the way we had to in the Focus. It has adjustable proportional braking, with a controller in the cab to let you adjust it if conditions change. So, not as much of a PIA as it could've been.
Hooked up with the tow bar and lo and behold, a downward angle, as Blue~Go suspected. Not steep, but enough to warrant a riser for the hitch.
So, now I'm ready to tow safely for my trip in November
1999 Premier, now minus all passenger side cabinets and appliances
Re: Brake assist systems
Yay, good to hear! I'm especially happy to read your report on the Brake Buddy in the CR-V because I'm helping a friend set up a CR-V for towing and there is a tight budget involved. Thus I suggested perhaps a used Brake Buddy (looks like about $300 on CL for a decent one). Good to know it's not as bad as it could be to set up each time. (And yeah, for a couple times a year, even easier.)
I looked through the installation instructions for the Stay in Play and while none of it is hard, it's fiddly and there are a number of steps, so I can see why they'd charge a bunch of hours for labor. As it turns out, I'm going to move the main "box" because the shop that installed it (when the car was not mine) put it RIGHT in front of the radiator, which they tell you not to do (and my car needs every bit of that radiator). So I'm going to be "reinstalling it," hence I was reading the instructions.
I looked through the installation instructions for the Stay in Play and while none of it is hard, it's fiddly and there are a number of steps, so I can see why they'd charge a bunch of hours for labor. As it turns out, I'm going to move the main "box" because the shop that installed it (when the car was not mine) put it RIGHT in front of the radiator, which they tell you not to do (and my car needs every bit of that radiator). So I'm going to be "reinstalling it," hence I was reading the instructions.
1999 Concourse
Re: Brake assist systems
I towed my Jeep Wrangler extensively with my 24' 1993 Tioga Class C on an E350 chassis without any brake assist. It was brutal on the brakes. (Jeep Wrangler's are not light but great toads for exploring) It put so much heat into the rotors that they literally developed radial cracks. I have yet to tow with my Chinook but if I did I would certainly go to some type of braking system. (The E450's have much better brakes and suspension.)
Steve aka SMan
2004 Premier V10
2004 Premier V10
Re: Brake assist systems
It's also illegal in most places nowadays (don't know about back then).
Although the 2008-ish and up E-350 front brakes/suspension are much larger than the earlier ones (the stock brakes on my Chinook were the same ones as on my little E-250 van!). Much better (I have 2014 brakes/front components on my Chinook now). I wouldn't tow without supplementary brakes though even with the beefier brakes (even if I could do so legally) because it's still just a bunch more wear and tear on the tow vehicle brakes.
1999 Concourse